In this episode of the Amal Podcast, we speak with Eva Bernet Kempers, postdoctoral researcher at the University of Antwerp and research associate at the Cambridge Centre for Animal Rights Law, about how animals are treated in law today and how legal change might realistically unfold.

The conversation unpacks what animal law is, why animals are still largely treated as property despite legal reforms stating that “animals are not things”, and what these shifts mean in practice for courts and everyday cases. Eva discusses different approaches to animal protection, including gradual legal change through stronger enforcement and access to justice, rather than immediate recognition of animal personhood.

We also explore the “starting at home” principle and why consistency matters when regulating animal harm, as well as emerging developments to watch: from Finland’s proposed constitutional chapter on animal rights to innovative judicial approaches in Latin America.

If you are curious, listen to the episode and delve into an often-overlooked field of law.